Starter motors

[blekkja]

My car hasn't been starting recently: just making an annoying click. I've put in a NOS Solenoid and then cleaned up every single connection in the HT Circuit. Still no joy. Finally in a "you are going to start ya bastard" moment rolled it down the drive and almost jumped it. (Not much of a slope) However the starter is actually turning now, which is weird/nice. Unfortunately though it seems to have lost all it's teeth.

Before the Solenoid went (assuming it did - though it was overdue replacement anyway) I haven't really had any issue starting it, excepting the cold weather, and no indication that the teeth were on the way out. Is there something serious here or should I just replace the teeth and carry on? I did check the ring gear before I installed the Starter in the first place because it was also NOS (apparently; I have my suspicions) and I didn't want to fuck it.

I have an poked inertia-engaged unit lying about that has good teeth - am I going to be able to use these to replace the ones on my good motor? It is an older style one with a remote solenoid, btw.

[oldschool]

The main reason for stripped teeth on a starter is a miss-match with the ring gear.
The ring gear has a 'lead-in' cut into the teeth to help the starter engage.
The same ring gear is used whether your Avenger has an inertia starter or a pre-engaged one, it's just fitted to match the particular type of starter.
The inertia starter needs the ring gear to be fitted with the lead-in facing the rear, while the pre-engaged type needs the lead-in facing the front.
So before you repair your starter, check which way the ring gear lead-in is facing?
If you look in the starter hole and there's no lead-in visible, that means it's on the rear and you need to use an inertia starter.
If you can see the lead-in through the starter hole, you'll need to use a pre-engaged starter.
Also check the ring gear teeth are all 100% okay at the same time, as even slight burring will wreck the starter pinion.

[Paddy75]

Aye its the same ring teeth around the flywheel, just have the chamfer, the shoulder facing the engine (pre-engaged) or the gearbox (inertia/bendix drive) I did one for a mini years ago. You have to put the new ring teeth in your oven for 30mins or so - just not too hot, the steel will become too soft if u heat it up too much. Put a bit of grease on the flywheels ring seat after you break off the old ring.

Then stuff as much driveshaft (the black CV boot grease) grease as u can into the starter's gear.
Happy a-startin'!

[blekkja]

Damn. Motor is newer than the car and when I think back it would have originally had an inertia-engaged unit. Guess I will have a look tomorrow and hope for the best. I really don't want to have to take the engine out if I don't have to. (It's easy enough, but if it is out then I'm not putting back in until it's been completely done over)

[oldschool]

Yeah I think they changed the starter type with the 1300/1600 motor upgrade in late 1973 (UK) early 1974 (NZ)
So your newer motor will need to use a pre-engaged starter.
Horopito Motors (Smash Palace) in Ohakune have some pre-engaged Avenger starter motors for sale.
You can also use a BLMC 1800 one...MGB, Marina, Princess, etc.
Just check the solenoid is offset towards the top, to clear the Avenger steering universal.

[blekkja]

My motor is a 1500, I'm fairly certain. 1973. It def had a pre-engaged though - the Super is the only car I've had with the older style.

Is there any way I can check the numbers somewhere on the block and work out what year / etc the motor was made? The blocks are all essentially the same, right?

[oldschool]

LOL...you might have a 1600 then??
I have a 1971 1500 and a 1974 1600 and the blocks look the same. The differences I've noticed are in the accessories:
The 1600 has a twin exhaust pipe manifold, the 1500 has a single
The 1600 has a Lucas 45D4 dizzy, the 1500 a 25D4
The 1600 has an all metal fuel pump, the 1500 has a glass bowl on top
The 1600 has plastic fan blades, the 1500 metal
The 1600 has a pre-engaged starter, the 1500 an inertia

Of course the accessories can be swapped over from block to block, so that's still not a 100% sure way of telling.
I guess if your motor has most of the 1600 parts listed, it's probably a 1600??

[blekkja]

Don't think that will be much help: I've got a custom exhaust, electric fan and NOS Pump etc... everything that can be replaced has been. There is a chance the Dizzy is the one it came with - it is prob 6 years since I wrecked that car - so I will have a look. I've found that distributors are not very easily changed between engines for whatever reason - none of my old Hillman ones wanted to work with my Chrysler 1300...

I do remember messing around with Metal Fan Blades though... when changing Water Pumps. Um.

I might have to rip the head off and measure the cylinders to get any definite answer.

[blekkja]

I think I've been getting confused to what starter is what. Anyway I have for whatever reason got a spare Pre-Engaged unit that works - just been out with a pair of jumper leads testing it - and the ring gear looks fine. I'll put it in tomorrow since it is starting to get dark.